Recap: Boruch called Shimon a sheigetz for eating popcorn and peanuts on Erev Pesach, when chametz was already forbidden. Shimon politely explained that his posek ruled that popcorn is permitted, and peanuts are not even kitniyos.
Boruch: I’m sorry to intrude at the last minute, but it turns out all my food is chametz. Can I join you for the sedarim?
Shimon: Sure.
Boruch notices that Shimon seems to be moving the Seder along fairly quickly.
Boruch: Shimon, what’s the rush?
Shimon: When I was a bochur, I merited joining HaGaon HaRav Henoch Leibowitz, zt”l, for his sedarim. The first Seder was surprisingly quick, while the second Seder was longer and more in line with what I expected. I asked my Rebbe why the first Seder was so short, and he responded: “The Rebbetzin has been working tirelessly and non-stop to make Pesach, and I should keep her up?!”
Along the same lines, I once discussed with HaRav Binyomin Forst that I would be having my elderly grandparents at the Seder and might have to rush it. He told me, “You are fortunate to have grandparents at your Seder. Appreciate the opportunity, and don’t worry too much if you have to go a bit faster.” In fact, Rabbi Shaya Cohen told me that having grandparents at the Seder is actually integral to the entire idea of the Seder. We’re trying to pass our mesorah to the children, and when children see their grandparents participating, it strengthens that mesorah even more.
The Seder finishes rather quickly, and Boruch returns the next night.
Boruch proceeds to say a lengthy dvar Torah, and Shimon responds with, “Chatzos.”
The next time Boruch begins another long dvar Torah, Shimon again says, “Chatzos.”
Boruch: Does “Chatzos” mean yasher koach?
Shimon: No, it means hurry up — we have to finish before chatzos.
Boruch: Why?
Shimon: The pasuk says the Korban Pesach should be eaten on “this night” (Shemos 12:8), and regarding the plague of the firstborn, which occurred at midnight, it says it will happen on “this night” (Shemos 12:12). From here we derive that the Korban Pesach must be eaten by midnight.
Boruch: Let’s put aside for a moment that we’re not eating the Korban Pesach, but if your drasha were true, you should have to eat the Korban Pesach precisely at midnight!
Shimon: Good point. But since it’s humanly impossible to eat a kezayis of the Korban Pesach precisely at midnight, the Torah must mean we must finish the Korban Pesach by midnight.
Boruch: Maybe the start time is midnight, not the end time.
Shimon: The Torah’s ways are pleasant, and if we’re forced to choose between ending at midnight or starting at midnight, it’s more logical that midnight is the end time. People usually eat at night. The alternative would require people to start eating at midnight, which is not a normal time to eat.
Boruch: But maybe the Torah doesn’t mandate finishing at midnight. Maybe you could eat the Korban Pesach all night. After all, the Torah says, “And you shall eat it [the Korban Pesach] in haste” (Shemos 12:11). When was the time of haste? When the Bnei Yisrael left Mitzrayim — during the day. They didn’t sneak out in the middle of the night.
Shimon: Yes, Rabbi Akiva says precisely what you say — that the Korban Pesach may, in fact, be eaten all night. But Rabbi Elazar ben Azaryah rules that it may only be eaten until chatzos.
Boruch: Okay, this is easy. The rule is we pasken like Rabbi Akiva against his disputant, so the Korban Pesach may be eaten all night.
Shimon: Well, Abaye rules that even Rabbi Akiva agrees you must eat the Korban Pesach by midnight as a Rabbinic safeguard. Indeed, the Gra rules this way.
Boruch: But the Rashba disagrees and says that according to Rabbi Akiva, you may indeed eat the Korban Pesach all night.
Shimon: Yes, but if you’ve been learning the daf, you know that there’s an anonymous Mishnah that follows Rabbi Elazar ben Azaryah’s view. The Mishnah states (Zevachim 56b) that the Korban Pesach must be eaten by midnight. Why did Rabbi Yehuda HaNasi record this opinion anonymously? To demonstrate that the halacha should follow this view.
Boruch: Yes, but elsewhere in Shas, the opinion of Rabbi Akiva is also recorded anonymously in Mishnayos.
Shimon: But here in Zevachim is the primary place where korbanos are discussed, so we should follow the Mishnah here.
Boruch: But there are at least three other Mishnayos that anonymously record Rabbi Akiva’s opinion.
Shimon: Well, Tosfos here in Zevachim rules like Rabbi Elazar ben Azaryah.
Boruch: But the Ran and other Rishonim rule like Rabbi Akiva.
Shimon: Since it’s an unresolved debate, I choose to be machmir, and the Shulchan Aruch says so, too.
Boruch: What are you talking about? The Shulchan Aruch doesn’t discuss the Korban Pesach!
Shimon: True, but Rava in Pesachim (120b) ties the opinions of these Tanaim to the mitzvah of eating matzah. Whenever you are allowed to eat the Korban Pesach, that’s when you can fulfill the Torah obligation to eat matzah.
Boruch: So you mean to tell me that if I eat matzah after chatzos, I can’t recite the bracha of “Al achilas matzah”?
Shimon: Precisely. That’s how the Mishnah Berurah rules (477:6). He rules the same way for marror as well.
Boruch: Okay, then we’d better hurry up.
They proceed with the Seder and eat matzah and marror. During the festive meal, Boruch begins another long-winded dvar Torah.
Shimon: Chatzos.
Boruch: Again with chatzos? We ate matzah already!
Shimon: Yes, but there’s discussion about with which matzah one primarily fulfills his obligation — the initial matzah or the afikomen. The Shulchan Aruch (477:1) rules that one should be careful to even eat his afikomen before chatzos.
They finish their meal, eat the afikomen, and Boruch begins yet another long dvar Torah.
Shimon: Chatzos.
Boruch: Again?!?
Shimon: The Korban Pesach was eaten together with Hallel. Hallel is also tied to matzah and the Korban Pesach. The Chofetz Chaim ruled in Machaneh Yisrael that one who finishes Hallel after chatzos cannot say the concluding bracha of Hallel.
Boruch: You’re not going to get me on that. The Chofetz Chaim clearly retracted that position, because in the Mishnah Berurah he writes that you can still say the bracha on Hallel even if it’s recited after chatzos.
Shimon: True. Nevertheless, the Rema writes that it’s best to finish Hallel before chatzos.
They finish Hallel, and Boruch begins another long-winded dvar Torah.
Shimon: Chatzos.
Boruch: Again?!? What now?
Shimon: The Gra writes that all four cups should be drunk before chatzos, since they are tied to the mitzvos of the Seder.
Boruch: But the Maaseh Rav says that the Gra himself drank the fourth cup after chatzos.
Shimon: Yes. One has to understand that although it’s best to finish the afikomen, Hallel, and four cups before chatzos, sometimes there are other factors. Let’s say a mother made a delicious meal — should you say, “Sorry, can’t eat the meal; have to finish Hallel”? Circumstances sometimes dictate that we must be lenient about certain practices, even if ideally we’d prefer to be strict.
Maggid shiur and Rebbe at Yeshiva Ateres Shimon in Far Rockaway. He leads the Daf Yomi chaburah at Eitz Chayim of Dogwood Park in West Hempstead, and writes “Delving into the Daf” each week for The Jewish Home.
